Speaking of Blends

[gillmang]

There is an excellent discusssion of the Seagram whisky making philosophy and the applied techniques in Michael Jackson's 1987 World Guide To Whisky. I wonder how much of what is described still exists, e.g., does Gimli, Manitoba (the surviving Seagram plant) distill the flavouring whiskies as well? My sense is it may not (hence the stories of straight whiskey being brought in from Kentucky to be blended with aged high proof whisky, but who knows.. ?). I looked again today in two flagship LCBO stores for the new whisky - it isn't there. I do not agree with that, I think it should be offered on its home turf before or at the same time as it is launched in other countries.

Gary

[Bourbon Joe]

I think it should be offered on its home turf before or at the same time as it is launched in other countries.

Gary

So Gary, I guess Canadian distillers are just as greedy as the US where Kentucky distillers routinely release their best stuff to Japan without selling it to us. Just ain't right.
Joe

[gillmang]

Hi Joe, well, I don't think commercial considerations play into it.

It might be available in other parts of Canada (I don't know but I think this unlikely since Ontario is the biggest market for alcoholic beverages in Canada - maybe Manitoba stocks it).

I think it is more the way the provincial liquor monopolies work. It takes time for products to work their way into the system (be listed, etc.) and I don't think the producer necessarily has that much say.

I guess I'd have preferred that with such a launch the powers that be work it out that it was sold in Ontario first or at least at the same time as it became available elsewhere. I am sure ultimately it will be sold here. Whisky, despite the occasional promotional campaign of our liquor boards, tends to get less attention than wine and other drinks. At one time we had e.g. a broad range of Scotch malts. Now it is much reduced. Unfortunately bourbon too (I am speaking of Ontario but again it is Canada's biggest market) seems down in availability. Yesterday at one of our main stores I saw JD (not a bourbon of course), Booker's, Knob Creek, Beam White and Black, Wild Turkey, Rebel Yell and Woodford Reserve. That was it.

Gary

[bourbonv]

Gary,
I think what you are trying to say here is that Canada is like one big control state and the government is more interested in numbers of sales than catering to the taste of a few with small sales numbers brands. To get the special release products the store has to have a set number of presold orders to add the product to their inventory. Is this correct?

[gillmang]

I don't know if that is right, Mike (about pre-orders). There is I know a listing procedure and it can take time to list a new bottle. It's just not like in a fully private market where there is an incentive to obtain and carry the product as soon as possible. Some products (e.g. some of the specialty CC range) seem to come and go with no apparent logic. This is the system we have and despite calls in some quarters to privatise, it hasn't happened and never will in my view..

Gary

[bourbonv]

Gary,
Do you think there will ever be distillery sale of the their products? I did not think it would ever happen in Kentucky, but it did. That would be one way to get specialized products on the market before the state stores get it.

[gillmang]

It is not allowed currently as far as I know. I find it hard to think this will ever happen here. Our distilleries are remote factories and are really unknown to almost everyone here even whisky enthusiasts. I recall a liquor store employee assuring me there were only three producing plants in Canada (there are 9 or 10)... With such a situation, it seems hard to think direct sales will ever come about. The industry is conservative and doesn't announce itself very much (exception for Kittling Ridge in Grimsby). Even though most of it is owned internationally, the local units seem to operate much as they always did, in obscurity will no fanfare. Probably this is a carryover from the old days when alcohol was seen as a negative force in society. We shouldn't forget there was a lot of temperance sentiment in Canada. Since the distillers have the liquor boards as a long-standing retail outlet for their goods, reliable and "there", they seem not to feel they should explain what they do to the public at large (or that part of it which is interested). The one exception was the fine Seagram whisky museum, which sadly closed and was disassembled some years ago in Waterloo, Ontario. I have never heard that any distillery does any kind of tour. Maybe some do on an informal basis. I should travel down to Walkerville and see what can be toured at Canadian Club (now a Beam Brands property). There is some kind of museum there I understand.

Maybe one day a group of us can go down there and tour together.

Gary

[bourbonv]

Gary,
That is an invitation that I will have to take you up on sometime.

Do you think the fact that the plants are more often simply blending plants than true distilleries is the cause of this lack of tours? Or do you think that Canadian Whisky has not the following of fans that bourbon has is the cause? Maybe a little of both? Something else?

[gillmang]

No, Canadians are proud of their national whisky style. I think it is just a combination of no history of doing it and no incentive since sales channels are well-established. I know there are industry ad codes, maybe it is felt tours would put them off-side that, I don't know. Koji told me he enjoyed his tour of Walkerville a few months ago and said it was interesting how CC 12 year old is "put together". I'll see him at KBF and ask him more about the tour and how he arranged it, I know he had a small group with him.

Gary